Ep. 56 - Robert G. Callahan, II

2/12/26, 5:00 PM

Grace interviews Robert G. Callahan, II about his book, Fire in the Whole.

Welcome to Madang.

Madang is the outdoor living room of the world. Here, we invite you to sit and tune into unreserved, remarkable conversations with renowned authors, leaders, public figures, and scholars on religion, culture, and everything in between.

This is the 56th episode featuring Robert G. Callahan, II. Robert is an accomplished attorney and author, dedicated to fighting for justice in his practice at Callahan & King, PLLC in Waco, Texas. He earned a Bachelor of Arts in Political Science from Gonzaga University and a Juris Doctorate at Baylor University School of Law where he teaches a course entitled Integrating Faith and Legal Practice. In 2020, Robert was named Lawyer of the Year by the Texas Criminal Defense Lawyers' Association. Robert’s book, FIRE IN THE WHOLE: Embracing Our Righteous Anger with White Christianity and Reclaiming Our Wholeness, tackles spiritual abuse via the church’s complicity with racism, patriarchy, and bigotry while encouraging survivors that their anger is justified and path to healing does exist.

On this episode of Madang Podcast, hosted by Faith and Reason, Callahan and I talk about his book, Fire in the Whole: Embracing Our Righteous Anger with White Christianity and Reclaiming Our Wholeness. We discuss Black history, color-blind church, racism, whiteness, anger, reconciliation, and much more.

Many thanks to this month's Madang Podcast sponsors:

THE UPPER ROOM

I want to tell you about a Lenten resource I think a lot of you will really appreciate.

It’s called When Did We See You? A Lenten Exploration of Poverty & Wealth and it takes on something many churches struggle to talk about honestly—money.

Written by pastor and justice advocate Elizabeth Mae Magill, When Did We See You? is a thoughtful, deeply pastoral Lenten study that wrestles with poverty, wealth, and what it means to follow Jesus in an economically divided world. Magill draws from scripture, real congregational stories, and her own experience to ask hard but faithful questions about generosity, justice, and our responsibility to our neighbors.

The book is perfect for individuals or small groups and includes weekly chapters for Lent, daily reflection questions, and even litanies for Ash Wednesday and Good Friday.

In a world of both abundance and inequality, When Did We See You? guides us through a crucial and timely conversation about our money, economic justice, and God's call for a world with enough for all.

Learn more at https://store.upperroom.org/madang - and save 20% on your copies today with promo code MADANG at checkout.

This Lent, may we have eyes to truly see Christ in our neighbors, and respond with love and action.

CENTRAL SEMINARY

This episode is presented by Central Seminary – a historic, accredited, diverse, cross-cultural, and ecumenical seminary. Central Seminary equips students with the theological knowledge, spiritual insight, and practical skills needed to lead in an ever-changing world. Central offer numerous graduate degrees and certificates including our Certificate in Peace and Justice Ministry, which is facilitated in live, online classrooms. The Certificate in Peace and Justice Ministry will prepare you to lead and serve through social change in areas such as racial injustice, economic injustice, the climate crisis, war and violence, and more.

To learn more, visit www.CBTS.edu or search for Central Seminary Kansas City.

WJK PRESS

I am grateful to WJK PRESS for sponsoring this episode. Fire in the Whole equips Black Christians to make empowered decisions about their faith — whether that means leaving toxic spaces, building new communities, or reclaiming a liberating faith. Discussion questions and a personal inventory help readers decide what’s next. Learn more at wjkbooks.com.

PANAAWTM • (Pacific Asian and North American Asian Women in Ministry and Theology)

An upcoming vocational discernment gathering hosted by PANAAWTM — the Pacific Asian North American Asian Women in Theology and Ministry, tentatively planned for late March or April, will create space for reflection, conversation, and communal wisdom around calling, leadership, and faithful imagination—especially for those navigating ministry, academia, and public life in complex times. More details will be shared soon.

PANAAWTM will be hosting an upcoming virtual annual business meeting, tentatively planned for March. This gathering is an opportunity for our community to come together, share key updates, and participate in the work of sustaining PANAAWTM’s mission and leadership. We look forward to sharing more details as plans are finalized, and we would be honored to have you join us.

Please reach out to me if you would like to sponsor the next episode of the Madang podcast⁠. Or simply ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠support me on my Substack: Loving Life⁠.

Madang is presented by FaithAndReason.org.